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Family Forum / Parenting / Parenting / July 2004



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I am not payng CS for over a year, what kind of sh.t I am in?

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John Semon - 19 Jul 2004 02:35 GMT
Long story short

-Married and divorced in Boston, MA. Ordered to pay $125/week although
I was making 27K a year but had a condo in a different state worth
22K. Started CS payments in 1997 when my son was born. Continued to
pay till I was fired in August 2001. Stopped paying CS because of no
income and no unemployment benefit. Moved to TX in 2001 December.
Found a job in March 2001. They found out that I got a job and started
to cut from my paycheck. Laid off again in March 2003 and started
collecting unemployment. Then I got a job 2 months ago.

1)Now, CS agency of MA knows my address keeps sending this stubs
totalled to over 5K.

2)Mother does not let me talk to my son nor wanna send him here for
vacation.

Questions

1)Are interstate CS incidents complicated or can I do this on my own?
Are there publications books I should read?

2)Am I gonna be arrested?

3)I am married to lovely woman and the mother is not and she is maing
40K now and I am making 47K.

PLEASE HELP
Bob Whiteside - 19 Jul 2004 03:09 GMT
> Long story short
>
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> 1)Are interstate CS incidents complicated or can I do this on my own?
> Are there publications books I should read?

Yes, they are more complicated but only because there are two states
involved and they tend to have problems coordinating their records.  There
is a lot of legal detail, but the basic stuff is the state where you live
will give "full faith and credit" to a CS order out of the state where the
child resides.  Your challenge will be to make sure your state doesn't mess
up the origin state's CS order and subsequent modifications and the
collections in your state are recorded accurately in the origin state.

> 2)Am I gonna be arrested?

No. Unless of course you blew off a CS enforcement hearing in the other
state and they issued a bench warrant for your arrest.  Those warrants
usually only give fathers grief if they return to the origin state and get
stopped by the cops for a traffic infraction.  But they are ina fedral
database.  Now if you fled the origin state to avoid CS you could be charged
with a federal crime.  Owing $5K is the entry point for federal prosecution.

> 3)I am married to lovely woman and the mother is not and she is maing
> 40K now and I am making 47K.

It doesn't matter that you are married.  It doesn't matter what your wife
makes.  It's all based on your income.  The increased income will cause the
CS to go up at the next CS review.  Most states hold periodic reviews every
2-3 years.
Gini - 19 Jul 2004 03:19 GMT
>> Long story short
>>
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
>up the origin state's CS order and subsequent modifications and the
>collections in your state are recorded accurately in the origin state.
===
Ya know, Bob--We never dealt with PA CSE, ever in "our" ten years of paying
support. FL sent the income withholding order directly to the employer here in
PA and the money was sent directly to FL. by the employer. I believe (don't
quote me) that interstate cases do not involve the "foreign" state any more
unless there are enforcement issues. ie: there is no income to withhold, moves
around a lot, etc. Or were we just lucky to avoid that multi-state trap?
===
===
Bob Whiteside - 19 Jul 2004 04:21 GMT
> >> Long story short
> >>
[quoted text clipped - 34 lines]
> ===
> ===

You are correct.  I tried to say there is a lot of legal detail.  I was
speaking from an enforcement standpoint, rather than a collection
standpoint.  I think that was the OP's concern.  If he pays the origin
state's CS billing there will be no multi-state collection effort.  But if
he fails to pay, like he suggested he did, the Interstate CS collection laws
will apply.
Gini - 19 Jul 2004 03:12 GMT
>Long story short
>
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>1)Are interstate CS incidents complicated or can I do this on my own?
>Are there publications books I should read?
===
They don't need to be--Depends on the state. Although they are inconvenient. You
can usually appear "telephonically," if you submit your request in writing. You
may/may not need an attorney but you are probably better off putting that 2k
retainer toward your arrears (that debt won't go away).
===

>2)Am I gonna be arrested?
===
You could be jailed for failure to comply with a court order. Your local sheriff
will let you know if/when that time comes.
===

>3)I am married to lovely woman and the mother is not and she is maing
>40K now and I am making 47K.
===
I don't see a question here.
===

>PLEASE HELP
===
We don't have that much money ;-)
===
===
Beverly - 19 Jul 2004 04:32 GMT
>Long story short
>
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>1)Are interstate CS incidents complicated or can I do this on my own?
>Are there publications books I should read?

Can you do what?  The LAST place you want to go right now is to court
given that she got you for $125/week in child support on an income of
$27K and now you make $47k.  The Bradley Amendment assures that your
arrearages will not be forgiven despite what your circumstances were.
So what is it your are trying to do?

If it is to reduce the arrearages and stay out of trouble, you could
always send the weekly amount (either yourself or through wage
withholding if they began that again) plus a little more.

>2)Am I gonna be arrested?

Unlikely if you stay out of court and attempt to reduce the
arrearages.  A lot depends upon how hard the ex pushes for it.

>3)I am married to lovely woman and the mother is not and she is maing
>40K now and I am making 47K.
>
>PLEASE HELP
John Semon - 19 Jul 2004 17:44 GMT
My ex will never go to court to let them arrest me, I know this as a
fact. But I do know that she is hiding her real income. Now that she
became a nurse making like 60K, she just wants me pay the balance
without going to court.

What am I supposed to do now? I know 125 a week is too much now but
then I did not know it. The probably saw the condo as a valuable asset
and marked up the CS payment.

I know she is making more than I do, what if I write to Boston CS
office and tell them to reduce/recalculate the payments because of my
long unemployment time.

Would this work?

> >Long story short
> >
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
> >
> >PLEASE HELP
DLove - 19 Jul 2004 20:16 GMT
I wish the news could be better BUT...if you checks were supposed to be
sent through the CS system then there is very little you can do to except
writing the DCSE and requesting a reduction. They are not required to give
you one and chances are they won't. The next alternative is to request a
court date and request the court re-evaluate the order. But because of the
law, arrearages can not be forgiven and even if the mother wants to
forgive them it is still up to the judge whether to allow this as they say
it's not her money but the childs. No matter what, plan on being served
for contempt when you appear in court unless you can make a substantial
payment. Best advice is to have the mother agree before court what your
payments could be and hope the judge will give it blessing. Sorry but not
many options are available once you are in the system because it's in
their interest to keep payments where they are at or higher since thats
how they recieve matching federal dollars. Ofcourse you can continue to
make monthly payment (whatever you can afford) and if and when a warant is
issued for you arrest and you are arrested and extradited back, you will
be able to say at least you sent SOMETHING and that might make them treat
you as harshly as someone who didn't send anything.

DLove  
Gini - 19 Jul 2004 21:52 GMT
>My ex will never go to court to let them arrest me, I know this as a
>fact. But I do know that she is hiding her real income. Now that she
>became a nurse making like 60K, she just wants me pay the balance
>without going to court.
====
IMPORTANT(Yes, I'm shouting): IF YOU PAY THE ARREARS DIRECTLY TO YOUR EX, YOU
WILL NOT RECEIVE CREDIT FROM CSE. As far as they are concerned, you will have
given her a gift and still owe the arrearages. DO NOT make any payment
arrangements with your ex without CSE/Court approval. Not even a notorized
statement/agreement signed by your ex will get you off the hook. Once the case
is opened with CSE everything *must* go through that office/court.
(More Below)
====

>What am I supposed to do now? I know 125 a week is too much now but
>then I did not know it. The probably saw the condo as a valuable asset
>and marked up the CS payment.
====
Who saw the condo? What do you mean by 125. is too much? If that is what was
ordered, then that is what is owed until a petition to modify is heard. The
modification will be only retroactive to the date of filing--not to when you
were out of work.
(More)
====

>I know she is making more than I do, what if I write to Boston CS
>office and tell them to reduce/recalculate the payments because of my
>long unemployment time.
====
CS cannot be reduced this way. What is accumulated is owed until paid. If you
are making 47k now, that is what will be used to calculate any modification. You
cannot reduce accumulated arrears without the court's approval and the court
rarely does this. If your ex agrees to it, the court might go along. You will
have to ask. Bob W. and/or Kenneth  (regular posters to acs) might be able to
give you pointers here, but this is usually local court discretion, but is
rarely done.
Too, if you go to court, your ex will also be required to file an affidavit of
income with tax returns.

It sounds to me that your best solution is to:

1. Start paying off the arrears immediately and make your payments of 125. a
week.
2. If you go to court now, you *will* see in increase in your order based on
your current income. It will not be reduced in consideration of your past
unemployment. You should have requested a modification when you got laid off
work.
3. Find your controlling state's CS guidelines online and put in yours and your
ex's *current* income to find out how much CS the court will award if you file
for a modification now.
====
====
The Dave© - 19 Jul 2004 22:33 GMT
> Gini wrote:
> You will have to ask. Bob
> W. and/or Kenneth  (regular posters to acs) might be able to give you
> pointers here,

Note to OP:  Not all Bobs are equal.

Signature

How come nobody uses words like "nifty", "spiffy", and "keen" anymore?

Gini - 19 Jul 2004 22:43 GMT
>> Gini wrote:
>> You will have to ask. Bob
>> W. and/or Kenneth  (regular posters to acs) might be able to give you
>> pointers here,
>
>Note to OP:  Not all Bobs are equal.
====
Hehe--That's why I put Bob W. (The other Bob is Bob-Bob--which takes into
consideration his affection for referring to himself in the third person and as
"we." )
====
====
Beverly - 19 Jul 2004 23:25 GMT
>My ex will never go to court to let them arrest me, I know this as a
>fact. But I do know that she is hiding her real income. Now that she
>became a nurse making like 60K, she just wants me pay the balance
>without going to court.

You are fortunate in that she wants to avoid court.  Your child
support is based upon what you and she USED to make... until such time
as a modification is filed.  Then it will be based upon what you
CURRENTLY make.  Unfortunately, it seems that child support guidelines
are slanted in such a way that they will get X% of the man's income
regardless of the woman's income.  I didn't believe that when I was
told that, but I checked it out and it seems to ring true.  Hence, get
over her now making $60K.  It's not likely to help you.

>What am I supposed to do now? I know 125 a week is too much now but
>then I did not know it. The probably saw the condo as a valuable asset
>and marked up the CS payment.

I hear that Massachusettes is absolutely the worst place for a man to
be ordered to pay support.  What do you do now?  Figure that $125 a
week is a lot better than $218 a week (same percentage of your income)
and pray the old order is never modified up.  

>I know she is making more than I do, what if I write to Boston CS
>office and tell them to reduce/recalculate the payments because of my
>long unemployment time.

Your period of unemployment is not going to matter now.  Arrears
cannot be forgiven (Bradley Amendment) and a modified order takes
current income into account.  IT IS TOO LATE TO SEEK A REDUCTION which
probably wouldn't have been granted when it wasn't.

Move on.  Count your blessings that your current order is based upon a
lower income and make an attempt to pay the arrearage down.  Pay it
THROUGH CSE, not to your ex, and KEEP RECORDS.

>Would this work?
>
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
>> >
>> >PLEASE HELP
PattymacI - 22 Jul 2004 00:59 GMT
1.  If the child did not receive welfare benefits, MA will not file a contempt
unless the cp requests one.

2. If you pay your order each week plus an addtional 25% toward the arrears, MA
will not file for contempt at the cp's request.

3.  The MA fiscal year began 7/1.  If you pay your entire current support
during this fiscal year and reduce the arrears balance, no additional interest
or penalty will be charged the entire year on the unpaid arrears.  But you are
stuck with what has accrued as of 6/30/04.

4.  You should have filed for a modification when you lost your job.  You
cannot file retroactively.  But since she didn't request an increase when your
income went up, you probably are breaking even or close to it.

5.  It's not that bad.  If you pay regularly from now on, you will be pretty
much ignored.  Except, of course, for the computer driven enforcements such as
tax intercepts or bank levies.  Those are completely automated and not the
result of you being specifically selected for enforcement.
Bob - 22 Jul 2004 01:07 GMT
> 1.  If the child did not receive welfare benefits, MA will not file a contempt
> unless the cp requests one.

The child NEVER receives benefits.  They only go to the mother.

Let's restate that:

1. If the mother did not receive payments, MA will not file a contempt
unless she requests one.

> 2. If you pay your order each week plus an addtional 25% toward the arrears, MA
> will not file for contempt at the cp's request.
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> tax intercepts or bank levies.  Those are completely automated and not the
> result of you being specifically selected for enforcement.

IOW:  The man's life is screwed.

Bob

Signature

When did we divide into sides?

"As president, I will put American government and our legal system back
on the side of women."  John Kerry, misandrist Democratic candidate for
President. http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/women/

[Bob does not advocate any illegal, seditious, or immoral acts.  All
posts are for discussion, rhetorical, or humorous purposes only.]

PattymacI - 23 Jul 2004 00:13 GMT
>From: Bob boby23456

>The child NEVER receives benefits.  They only go to the mother.

Wrong. If the child is eating food purchased with food stamps or grant money,
living in a home under sec 8 or paid for with grant money, receiving health
care through Masshealth or the equivalent, the child is receiving benefits.

>If the mother did not receive payments, MA will not file a contempt
>unless she requests one.

Whether or not the custodial parent receives benefits is irrelevant.  MA will
not initiate a contempt unless the child receives benefits.

This group could be a valuable resource for both noncustodial and custodial
parents.  But, blithering idiots like you have made it a joke, which is why I
rarely come here.

Brin, who makes a nice living handling and correcting support issues and
problems for noncustodial parents.
Bob - 23 Jul 2004 01:33 GMT
> This group could be a valuable resource for both noncustodial and custodial
> parents.  But, blithering idiots like you have made it a joke, which is why I
> rarely come here.

Greedy bitches using children as pawn to make men into indentured
servants, a form of slavery, isn't a joke.

It is hell for both the children and the fathers.

Bob

Signature

When did we divide into sides?

"As president, I will put American government and our legal system back
on the side of women."  John Kerry, misandrist Democratic candidate for
President. http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/women/

[Bob does not advocate any illegal, seditious, or immoral acts.  All
posts are for discussion, rhetorical, or humorous purposes only.]

 
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