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Family Forum / Parenting / Parenting / May 2009



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Charter Challenge for Canadian Fathers?

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Meldon - 26 May 2009 03:09 GMT
After all these years of its dominance in my life, I’m still confused
about the law. Can anyone make sense of legal process when laws seem
to contradict themselves? Correct me if I’m wrong but when legislation
passes and becomes law, that law can be challenged in Canada under
the
Charter of Rights and Freedoms?

Non-custodial parents are denied the same options for adoption as
custodial parents. A custodial parent can have their child adopted and
be absolved of financial obligation to them. A non-custodial parent
has no such motion available.

Remedy under Section 24 requires a violation of right to be shown.
This is managed through the Human Rights Tribunal?

Am I close?
Kenneth S. - 26 May 2009 14:17 GMT
>After all these years of its dominance in my life, I’m still confused
>about the law. Can anyone make sense of legal process when laws seem
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
>Am I close?

    I would guess it depends entirely on the political support you
can muster for your case.  

    I know little or nothing about Canadian law.  However, if the
process of deciding what is a human right is the same as in the U.S.,
then the crude application of interest group politics is the crucial
element. If the situation's the same in Canada, the Human Rights
Tribunal decision will be determed by such factors as whether there is
an influential interest group representing men.  If demonstrations
(and perhaps riots) can be organized in support of the "correct"
tribunal decision, that would help.

    I read that recently a Human Rights Tribunal in one of the
western Canadian provinces ended its proceedings against the Western
Standard newspaper over republication of Danish cartoons that Moslems
said were offensive.  The tribunal did so because of the pressure of
public opinion, and because the newspaper publisher had carefully
videotaped and otherwise recorded his contacts with the tribunal,
making it clear that tribunal officials were using improper tactics.

    It seems to me that illustrates the way the Canadian process
works.  There are powerful Moslem interest groups, and these tribunals
favor them unless some counter-forces can be mustered.  Presumably,
the same would apply to issues relating to the rights of the two
sexes.

    Can mothers in Canada have their children adopted without the
consent of the father?  What happens if the father says he wants
custody of the child?
Chris - 26 May 2009 15:22 GMT
>>After all these years of its dominance in my life, I'm still confused
>>about the law. Can anyone make sense of legal process when laws seem
[quoted text clipped - 42 lines]
> consent of the father?  What happens if the father says he wants
> custody of the child?

Then they make him pay "child support".
Meldon - 26 May 2009 15:37 GMT
> >After all these years of its dominance in my life, I�m still confused
> >about the law. Can anyone make sense of legal process when laws seem
[quoted text clipped - 42 lines]
> consent of the father?  What happens if the father says he wants
> custody of the child?

If a man is named by the mother, he needs to be notified but she or
the adoption agent is not necessarily held to notify the man if they
can't find him or if they can show he wasn't interested in the child
or supporting them.

I would argue your point about Muslims and the HRC. The HRC has been
in operation for a few decades and MANY special interests groups have
exploited it for years. No one said much about closing universities on
minority religious holidays and any other number of issues which have
over time shaped our country and in many cases for the worse.
Kenneth S. - 26 May 2009 16:29 GMT
>> >After all these years of its dominance in my life, I?m still confused
>> >about the law. Can anyone make sense of legal process when laws seem
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
>minority religious holidays and any other number of issues which have
>over time shaped our country and in many cases for the worse.

    Your point above is the one I had intended to make.

    In the U.S. the Supreme Court has a record of weird and
contorted interpretations of what is contained in the U.S.
constitution.  The explanation for these decisions is to be found --
not, of course, in anything written in the constitution -- but in the
influence of political and ethnic pressure groups, plus the gut
feelings of individual judges.

    Given the way these things work, I had assumed the same would
be true in Canada.  I had not intended to suggest that in Canada
Muslims have had some stronger influence than other special interest
groups.

    The lesson is clear  for fathers in the U.S. who are concerned
about such matters as "child support," the glass ceiling on paternal
custody, and the way men are discriminated against in reproductive
choice.  Absolutely nothing will change until judges and other
politicians are concerned about the strength of groups representing
fathers and men.  I would assume the same is true of Canada.

    Certainly, it would be unrealistic to accept the notion that
organizations like the U.S. Supreme Court or human rights tribunals in
Canada make a practice of applying written rules in a disinterested
and nondiscriminatory manner.  Instead, the principle is that the
squeaky hinge gets the oil -- particularly if the squeaks sound
intimidating to such people as supreme court justices and members of
human rights tribunals.
Meldon - 26 May 2009 17:06 GMT
> On Tue, 26 May 2009 07:37:28 -0700 (PDT), Meldon
>
[quoted text clipped - 88 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Here's news for the squeeky hinge - there's no more oil for you.
 
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