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Family Forum / Marriage / Marriage / May 2007Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified?
Hi, I'll try to make this as short as I can but I do want to give you the full story... My wife has been friends with this guy Mike at her place of employment for quite some time now. I'm guessing well over a year. He is a police officer. Originally, he came into her work on business and met her in the lobby. Early on, she mentioned him to me in a conversation. We were talking about a friend getting a traffic ticket and she said that she can ask this "cop guy" that comes into the office every so often. That was that. Many months later, I noticed that she had Mike in her contacts on her cell phone. I thought, not only does this guy come in and talk to her at the office; she also contacts him on the phone. A month later or so, I was looking at the cell phone bill and saw lots of text messages and calls to this guy. I didn't say anything. What I started doing was looking at her cell phone every other day, trying to view the text messages. There were none from him or to her; however, there were other text message from me and other people. After viewing the next month's cell bill, there were all kinds of messages going back and forth, but she would delete them all from her phone so I wouldn't see them. At this point, I confronted her on the issue, and she got all upset that I was checking her phone and "spying" on her. That's all she was focused on and she was pissed. I asked her why she was deleting them. She said that she didn't want me to read them that it's none of my business and I shouldn't be in her phone. She says that there is nothing going on and that this guy is just a "stupid cop" and she doesn't know what I'm so worried about. Of course, feeling like the bad guy for "snooping," I told her I was sorry and wouldn't go through her phone anymore and I do trust her. Weeks later, she went out with a girlfriend "for dinner." I guess based on instinct, I was suspicious of this outing. To make a long story short, I found out by driving to the restaurant, that she wasn't there and she was somewhere else with her girlfriend and some guy I didn't know. She says his name is "Ray" but I think it was this cop guy. Bottom line her is that she lied to me about where she was going and who she was with. A short time later, she was going out with the same girlfriend to visit a female coworker who was in the hospital. I thought, okay, no worries. I saw an email she sent to a friend at work asking, "How did the other night go," referring to this night. She replied saying, "It was fun. He was nice." "He?" There was also a text message from her phone sent to the person she was supposed to be visiting. Why would she send her a text message half way through her visit to the same person? So, with that...she's starting to lie to me about what she is doing and where she is going. Anyway, here's what my wife wants me to believe about this Mike guy. They are just friends and only talk every once in a while. He rarely comes to the office and when he does, he doesn't come by just to see her, he comes by to talk to everyone in the lobby. Here's what I know. I know that he comes by just to see her. I have snuck up to the office and two occasions on Saturday (no one else is there) and found his police cruiser outside. Of course, like I was saying, she says he doesn't come just to see her. Sure! I have hacked into her work voice mail and have heard messages from him that he left for her, like, "I'm downstairs waiting for you." "Hi, it's me...sorry I missed you but I would like to see you as soon as possible." "Hi it's me...call me back as soon as you can. You're probably busy, but I would at least like to hear your voice." In a nutshell, there is way more communication, both in person and by phone, then she wants me to know about. This has been eating at me now for many months. Thinking about what is going on and could be going on makes me sick to my stomach. I'm worried about it every day. It's all I think about. Whether or not she is "cheating" sexually, I don't know. But I don't like her having relations with another man like this, where everything is so secretive. She never gets calls from this guy when I'm around. Never contacts him when I'm around. I just feel like I'm being played. She wants me to trust her and not worry. How can I? I'm just so fed up with this. I can't ask her about it or tell her how I feel, because she doesn't understand. From what I can see, all the signs are there of, "is your wife having and affair?" I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I willing to bet that she does. Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified. Thanks for your time everyone > Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified. > > Thanks for your time everyone The "where there's smoke, there's fire" line, corny as it may be, works well here. Deep down, you know what's going on. >At this point, I confronted her on the issue, and she got all upset >that I was checking her phone and "spying" on her. That's all she was >focused on and she was pissed. Of couse she was pissed. If she is really doing nothing wrong, then she's pissed about being spied on. If she IS sneaking around, then she's becoming outraged to take the focus off of her conduct and back onto you for spying. There is really no way to win on the spying things. Having said that, 'm personally of the belief that cheaters are also liars, and sometimes the only way to figure out what's going on is to do some sleuthing because they are not going to admit their wrongdoing when asked, for the most part. (It's probably not a good idea to hack into her work voicemail. Depending on where she works, that seems like you could get into serious legal trouble.) >Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified. I think you already know the answer. It sounds to me like your worries are justified. Is she having a physical affair? Who knows. But her behavior is secretive and seems sneaky, so I'd be suspicious that there is some kind of inappropriate activity.  SignatureLauri in WA > At this point, I confronted her on the issue, and she got all upset > that I was checking her phone and "spying" on her. That's all she was > focused on and she was pissed. I'm very sorry to say that your story is typical of a cheated-on spouse. Right down to the "who do you believe, me or your lying eyes?" bit. Go here and read up on infidelity: marriagebuilders.com > Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified. My head shakes in instant recognition. She's absolutely cheating on you, even if it hasn't gotten as far as sex yet. She's calling and text messaging the guy, then deleting it from her phone to cover her tracks. She's lying about where she spends her time at night. He's going to her work to see her. Your common sense is telling you the truth. At the very least, she's totally infatuated with this guy. > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 86 lines] > > Thanks for your time everyone It sure sounds to me like your wife is involved in an emotional affair with this guy, if not a physical one. My wife went through almost exactly the same kind of thing. Assuming for the moment that this is not a physical affair yet, your wife may be thinking that she isn't doing anything wrong. She may figure that it isn't an affair since there is no sex involved. This is absolutely not true. An emotional affair is a violation of your marriage vows and IMHO it is just as much of a threat to your marriage as a physical affair. Your wife is playing with fire, and you need to make sure she knows it. Don't back down when you confront her on this. You are right to be suspicious and you are right to confront her. I am guessing she would not tolerate similar behavior on your part, and you shouldn't tolerate it from her. Having said that, I don't think you necessarily want to come down on her like a ton of bricks either. You need to make it clear that it is not acceptable for her to be maintaining a secretive emotional relationship with another man. Tell her how it makes you feel, including how worried and scared you are. But you need to also work on trying to find out why she feels the need to do this. Are there problems in your relationship that need to be addressed? Try to find out why she is doing this, and show her that you are willing to work on whatever her issues are. You might want to suggest marriage counseling to work on your relationship. A person in this stage of an affair is like someone addicted to a new drug. This new relationship is probably very exciting for her. It will probably be very difficult for her to stop this relationship, and it will probably not happen as quickly as you would like it to. Also, you probably really want to talk to her about this, but she is not likely to want to talk to you about it. Expect plenty of resistance from her, because deep down she knows that what she is doing is wrong and she probably feels shame about it. But just because she is resistant, it doesn't mean you should just back off. You need to act on this, and you need to help her to see that this is wrong, because it is going to be hard for her to see it that way. Do you have friends or family you can talk to about this? Don't hesitate to do that. You do not need to go through this alone. You should have support. You may even want to seek out a counselor for yourself to help you work through this. Best of luck to you Scott. My wife and I made it through a similar situation and our marriage is stronger now because of it. It can be done. > Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified. > > Thanks for your time everyone IMO, if you are having a relationship with another person, and you are hiding the relationship, or the nature of it, from your spouse, you are cheating, whether or not there has been any physical contact at all. I think you are getting too caught up in whether or not she's having sex, and not focussing on the fact that she is lying to you. Whatever the nature of her relationship with the police officier, relationships need to be built on honesty. Insist on counselling, and get this all out in the open in the presence of someone who can help the two of you get through it --- one way or another. Sheila > > Am I just crazy jealous or are my worries justified. > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > think you are getting too caught up in whether or not she's having sex, and > not focussing on the fact that she is lying to you. Yes. > Whatever the nature of her relationship with the police officier, > relationships need to be built on honesty. Insist on counselling, and get > this all out in the open in the presence of someone who can help the two of > you get through it --- one way or another. I think this is a good idea. Also, listen to Vulnero, who is a sensible person, and has been in a situation enough like yours so that his opinions should matter. > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 86 lines] > > Thanks for your time everyone Scotty - I'm sorry to say this because I know it's bringing you much pain - but your marriage is over - she is doing stuff on the side. I would be thinking out a plan to get out of this and start rebuilding your life. While there are some events that marriage counseling can help - the only thing that would make her drop the cop is economic and not love -she'd tell him to lowkey it for awhile. When you do get out - try to focus on your job and other interests and not drink too much or pick up one of the many other women out there looking for guys in your situation - you'll need time to heal but you will - if you want to. Keep us posted. MajorHart majorhart@sbcglobal.net > > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 106 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Scotty, your marriage is NOT necessarily over. Plenty of marriages have survived affairs. Mine is one of them. You do not have to give in to this kind of pessimism and despair. You can fight to save your marriage. > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 86 lines] > > Thanks for your time everyone Stop spying, you'll only make yourself look bad. I think you should suggest a marriage counsellor and the issue will get resolved one way or another. good luck >> Hi, >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > good luck Let add to this. Stop spying and confront her. Now. It all seem like at this point you are playing "I got the scoop on you". You have the evidence. Get it out in the open. I personally don't believe in reading wife's email, checking her cell phone, following her to work, etc. When you do stuff like that, you only get part of the picture, never the whole story. However, it seems to consume you, while she goes out enjoying herself, you sit at home wondering what she is doing. Not a way to live, in fact, it pretty much a sucky life to have. Take control. Sit her down, tell her what you know. If she gets piss, so be it, but at least it's out in the open. Oh, and the answer to your question, you are not crazy jealous, but you should not have let it got as far as it did. EB > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I > willing to bet that she does. Strickly based on your post ... Given the circumstances, discussion with her appears to be wasted. If I were in that situation, I'd "leave" and see what happens next. She'd either fight to hold on to what the two of you have or passively accept you leaving... Letting my imagination wander, she could easily be working on developing the relationship with the OG - then when the time is right, walk on you. Keep in mind, the OG "police officer", might not know she's married. SignatureSD:) > > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > -- > SD:) That would be a pretty poor police officer - in terms of his analytic ability. A woman who is sneaking around is pretty obvious, to me. A man who is a police officer, however, can seem to offer a great deal of safety to a woman exiting a relationship, if that woman is worried about her husband's reaction. Just saying. A. On May 27, 10:30 am, "Atalanta, O.G." <atalanta.brillia...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > > > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Speaking of reaction, Scotty one thing you should absolutely not do is make threats against the other guy. Do not leave a threatening voice mail message or email message. This will get you in a huge amount of trouble, especially considering that this guy is a police officer. > On May 27, 10:30 am, "Atalanta, O.G." <atalanta.brillia...@gmail.com> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > mail message or email message. This will get you in a huge amount of > trouble, especially considering that this guy is a police officer. Scotty, Trust your instincts. I think there is enough proof that she has something going on with this guy and she is unwilling to own the how this behavior is damaging your marriage. I just went through the discovery of the other woman a little more than a month ago. My husband's affair is over and we're working on repairing the damage his deceit has caused in our marriage. I won't lie to you regarding the restoration of trust. That's a hard one to rebuild. Our 19th wedding anniversary is Tuesday and I hope it's a happy one! I agree with Vulnero that a marriage can heal from this if both parties want to try. Stay away from the guy. He's really not the problem, you're wife's betrayal is the problem. Good luck! On May 27, 1:29 pm, wetea...@comcast.net wrote: > > On May 27, 10:30 am, "Atalanta, O.G." <atalanta.brillia...@gmail.com> > > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 49 lines] > > - Show quoted text - I am just over a year out since my wife ended her affair. It is much much better now, although I still have twinges of distrust now and then. Time really does make a big difference. Hang in there and keep working at it, and the trust will eventually come back. On May 27, 10:30 am, "Atalanta, O.G." <atalanta.brillia...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > > > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > - Show quoted text - That's interesting too - as my ex started dating a sheriff just after we parted. We didn't have any violence and I wasn't threatening her. > > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > -- > SD:) Since she is having the affair, why should he leave? If anyone should leave, it should be her. If he wants to go nuclear, then he should ask her to leave. But this is a very drastic step, and it shouldn't be taken in a knee-jerk way. So far, she hasn't even acknowledged that she is having an affair. I don't think he should start the process of splitting up with her until she has both acknowledged the affair and also refused or failed to end it. Then it might be time for that. > Since she is having the affair, why should he leave? If anyone > should > leave, it should be her. If he wants to go nuclear, then he should > ask her to leave. And if she says no? I've always thought the person initiating the separation is the one who is going to end up having to leave. > But this is a very drastic step, and it shouldn't > be taken in a knee-jerk way. So far, she hasn't even acknowledged > that she is having an affair. I don't think he should start the > process of splitting up with her until she has both acknowledged the > affair and also refused or failed to end it. Then it might be time > for that. Well, she may never acknowledge the affair. But I agree that separation shouldn't be a knee-jerk thing. Zorra > > Since she is having the affair, why should he leave? If anyone > > should [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > And if she says no? I've always thought the person initiating the > separation is the one who is going to end up having to leave. It just seems really unfair to me to force the one who is betrayed to find a new place to live. I suspect most cheaters who get caught red- handed would probably acknowledge that they are the ones who should find a new place to live. But if she did say no, I suppose there isn't much he could do to force her to leave. >> > Since she is having the affair, why should he leave? If anyone >> > should [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > find a new place to live. But if she did say no, I suppose there > isn't much he could do to force her to leave. Yeah, I agree it's not fair. I guess every situation is different, but in general someone who does not want to end the marriage is less likely to want to leave. When I was considering leaving DH, no infidelity involved, I knew that I'd have to be the one to leave, even though it would make much more sense for me to be the one to stay in the house because of the kids (no apartment complexes in the school district). So what it occurred to me to do was to find the apartment, tell him I was going, and give him the option then of being the one to leave, as he could probably find a cheaper place. Anyway, the crisis passed, and I don't think he ever knew how very close I was to leaving. Zorra > I don't think he should start the > process of splitting up with her until she has both acknowledged the > affair and also refused or failed to end it. That's fine for you... But, I will not foster poor or unhealthy behaviors between spouses. You also missed the part where I said "I'd "leave" and see what happens next." Based on what he said, she's not going to be forthcoming about her actions. So, "who" leaves isn't nearly as big a deal as finding out what she's really doing. And, leaving doesn't necessarily mean he's starting the splitting up process; it means he's not going to tolerate certain behaviors. Course, I am not of the mind to worry all that much about who leaves first, or what's materially at stake. SignatureSD:) > > I don't think he should start the > > process of splitting up with her until she has both acknowledged the > > affair and also refused or failed to end it. > > That's fine for you... But, I will not foster poor or unhealthy > behaviors between spouses. I don't think that by staying in the house he is fostering anything. But I think it would be hard to work on their relationship if he isn't there. > You also missed the part where I said "I'd "leave" and see what happens > next." Leaving is risky. It makes it that much easier for her to further her relationship with the OG if her husband is out of the picture. It may just push her right into the OG's arms, so what happens next might be the end of the marriage. > Based on what he said, she's not going to be forthcoming about her > actions. So, "who" leaves isn't nearly as big a deal as finding out [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > -- > SD:) Her reaction is not really that unusual. I think most cheating spouses who get caught initially want to try to deny that the situation even exists. So I don't know that we can conclude that she is never going to acknowledge the affair because of that. As far as leaving goes, I just think if anyone should leave it should be the cheater. But as I said before, I think it is way too early for that. > I don't think that by staying in the house he is fostering anything. > But I think it would be hard to work on their relationship if he isn't > there. He's in the house... Based on her stated behavior, that doesn't seem to mean anything to her. He's got to get her attention, and questioning or demanding her attention apparently hasn't worked. > Leaving is risky. It makes it that much easier for her to further her > relationship with the OG if her husband is out of the picture. It may > just push her right into the OG's arms, so what happens next might be > the end of the marriage. Leaving is only risky - if the one leaving fears rejection or being along at all costs. Her husband can't keep her from the OG, in the house or out. If his leaving means to her she's got a free road - I'd want to know that. On the other hand, his leaving might very well get her attention if the marriage means anything. End of marriage, don't think so. > Her reaction is not really that unusual. I think most cheating > spouses who get caught initially want to try to deny that the > situation even exists. So I don't know that we can conclude that she > is never going to acknowledge the affair because of that. He's strongly suspicious, but hasn't hard and fast proof. And, that can only be her coming forth honestly. She's only going to acknowledge when he stands up for his marriage. > As far as leaving goes, I just think if anyone should leave it should > be the cheater. But as I said before, I think it is way too early for > that. The person that is emotionally healthy possessing self-respect doesn't feel they deserve to be abused by a thoughtless morally bankrupt SO. Leaving shows self-respect and value for their marriage. Staying, given the circumstances means he will become the recipient of unspoken abusive behaviors. SignatureSD:) > > I don't think that by staying in the house he is fostering anything. > > But I think it would be hard to work on their relationship if he isn't [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > -- > SD:) I think you are taking a very black-and-white view of this situation. I doubt that she is as thoughtless and morally bankrupt as you think. She is human, and she probably has mixed feelings about what she is doing. She probably finds it both exciting and shameful. She may want to end it, but find that she just can't give it up. These are the shades of gray in which most people live their lives. And I don't think it is some kind of sign of weakness for him to stay with her. On the contrary, the easy thing might be for him to leave. It is probably harder to stay and try to work on the marriage. I have seen it advocated time and again in this group that if a spouse has cheated, the betrayed spouse should just call it quits and bail out on the marriage. I know a lot of people here have suffered because of cheating spouses, and I know there is plenty of residual anger and hurt. But this is a marriage _support_ group. The goal isn't to point people to the nearest exit from their marriage. And we should not exploit the posts of people who are in troube in order to exorcise our own demons. > But this is a marriage _support_ group You're ignoring the simple fact, "support" equates to a variety of words and behaviors to different people; my views are one - yours another. You don't set the tone. And, just maybe the twine shall never meet; which is fine for me since you seem to misunderstand my words and resulting intent... Leaving doesn't necessarily mean the "big D" will result. So, take off your "my way is the only way" glasses and let others provide a different perspective. By the way, using the words "exploit the posts", as if posters are gaining something underhandedly distorts. It's sad and alarmingly that some ASM posters haven't a clue as to opinion boundaries - but, that's another topic.. > > But this is a marriage _support_ group > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > some ASM posters haven't a clue as to opinion boundaries - but, that's > another topic.. I don't think my view is the only view. I am just tired of seeing posts over and over again where at the first sign of infidelity people advise calling the lawyers and packing the bags. I understand you weren't quite doing that. You advocate leaving as a form of wake-up call. Personally, I wouldn't experiment on my marriage like that at this stage of the infidelity, but I suppose it could work. Anyway, I'm sorry if I offended you. I was only partially reacting to your post. It was mostly a general rant on my part. > first sign of infidelity people > advise calling the lawyers and packing the bags. Again you use words above where they didn't exist... also the reason people might get offended when trying to talk about difficult subjects and behaviors. He needs to get his wife's attention. Right now, he doesn't have it and she apparently doesn't care to give it. The worst thing he can do is wait to see... doing so would harm his emotional state even more then facing his wife's truth. It takes two willing pro-active people to make a happy marriage; otherwise - the marriage wont' last. The only person experimenting is the OP's wife with the OG and how far she can push her husbands tolerance before taking care of himself. SignatureSD:) > > first sign of infidelity people > > advise calling the lawyers and packing the bags. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > wait to see... doing so would harm his emotional state even more then > facing his wife's truth. There are other ways that are likely to be more effective than packing one's bags, and simultaneously less likely to provoke a defensive reaction. > It takes two willing pro-active people to make a happy marriage; > otherwise - the marriage wont' last. The only person experimenting is > the OP's wife with the OG and how far she can push her husbands > tolerance before taking care of himself. > > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > -- > SD:) The police officer might not know she's married is important - you need to find his car there and drop a note inside - letting him know that you are aware of his visits to YOUR wife. Be aware thought, that if she is on the hunt - or just attached to this guy - there will be others. Are you planning your own life ahead by now? If not, start working on a plan because this marriage is probably over.l These things can happen very quickly - often women don't think of leaving their man for another - unless they are really unhappy OR put into constant contact with an aggressive pursuer - who makes them feel special -something they (she) might not have felt with you. I had a g/f I loved very much and it was mutual. She took a job as a bartender, and at first she had some trouble with band members putting pressure on her. I went in there and told them they better back off and they did. Still 3 weeks later, she turned COLD in bed - no more sex or touching and then said she was leaving and did. My g/f might have been wanting marriage and/or babies but she never said that to me. She had a little girl when we met and I loved the little girl too. Just that quick - a 3 years living together and having a ball ended. If you're the train that is going where a woman wants to go -she will stay onboard - if you're not - she's likely to leave anytime a new train comes along. suddenly MajorHart Good luck - keep us posted. > > > I have never caught them together or seen any messages or things from > > > her to him that would indicate that she has feelings for him, but I [quoted text clipped - 46 lines] > > - Show quoted text - hi I am omar from syria my enghlish is little can be frienf thanks > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 86 lines] > > Thanks for your time everyone Why don't you go get a lawyer and make arrangements to dump her. There are some good websites on how to secretly prepare for divorce so that you don't get screwed . Start hiding some money. You can also hire a detective to watch her. It sure sounds like she's running around. I would prepare for the worst and then tell her you want a divorce because you've had enough. Why live with that? |
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