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Family Forum / Parenting / Single Parents / July 2006Drugs with custody?
I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with this... A friend and I were talking not long ago, and it came up a little while back when she and her bf had an episode and although in the end, things were worked out to an extent and are currently being worked on, HE said he was going to take the baby (10 months old), fight for custody and bla bla bla. One of those anger 'threats' and all that. In this case, there's no way anyone in their right mind would put a baby or child with this guy. He's a good dad and person, but with a temper, and fairly selfish in some ways. In the case of him leaving, he would also have no real home. He'd be stuck living with friends, and in this case, not a good scene. Drugs, alcohol, whatever. Not good, AFAIC, or anyone would be concerned, for that matter. She simply said (to him) that there would be no need for courts and all that. She would totally and fully agree 100% to him coming by and/or spending time with the kids in or out of the house. She also said that if it ever came to this, she would also request that the one and only condition would be that he pisses clean once a month in order to see his kids. That would, I guess, mean no drugs in his system at all. Anyone ever hear of this? Basically saying that in order to see your child(ren) you have to stay off the drugs. That's all. One and only 'condition'. Would something like this be possible? Would a demand or request like this hold any weight? Would there be any benefit from something like this, assuming it was possible, and assuming it's a known fact that the person is a drug user...? >I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with this... > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] >assuming it was possible, and assuming it's a known fact that the person is >a drug user...? How would she enforce the drug test? Watch him pee? And what if it turns up positive? How will she handle it if he gets angry about not seeing his kid because he smoked a joint 20 days earlier? And even if she pee tests him, that's not to say the first thing he's going to do when he gets the kids is pull over and smoke, inhale, pop, or inject his drug of choice with the kids in the car. She's better off insisting on a treatment program. >>I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with this... >> [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > How would she enforce the drug test? I guess I didn't state clearly... She said no custody battle, just court enforced stuff like visits, whatever. Just not a big, messy, expensive, bitter court battle. She'd walk in saying, yes, I want him to visit, take the kids, be with them, see them, not have the stance of kicking him out of the kids' life completely. Have a drug test as a mandatory thing through the courts. > Watch him pee? And what if it turns > up positive? In this case, if there was a court order, it would be his fault for messing up and failing, not hers. > How will she handle it if he gets angry about not seeing > his kid because he smoked a joint 20 days earlier? Then wouldn't this be his problem to handle? >And even if she pee > tests him, that's not to say the first thing he's going to do when he > gets the kids is pull over and smoke, inhale, pop, or inject his drug of > choice with the kids in the car. Then come the next month, he'd fail, wouldn't he? > She's better off insisting on a > treatment program. Not that this is the case, as it was just a convo that came up from an incident of stupidity and angry words with them (that I thought was stupidity, and both of them agree it was downright stupid) how effective would a treatment program be? >> How would she enforce the drug test? > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >In this case, if there was a court order, it would be his fault for messing >up and failing, not hers. I thought this was going to be a nice, easy, no mess custody hearing. Does he know about what she wants to do or is she just going to spring it on him at the hearing? >> How will she handle it if he gets angry about not seeing >> his kid because he smoked a joint 20 days earlier? > >Then wouldn't this be his problem to handle? If she is trying to regulate his behavior when he doesn't have children in his custody, then this is about her and not his habit. >>And even if she pee >> tests him, that's not to say the first thing he's going to do when he >> gets the kids is pull over and smoke, inhale, pop, or inject his drug of >> choice with the kids in the car. > >Then come the next month, he'd fail, wouldn't he? but the purpose of the test is to keep the kids safe, isn't it? She has no way to keep them safe in the present moment... which, I assume, is her goal - to keep her children safe while they're in his custody. In that case, pee tests will not ensure their safety. >> She's better off insisting on a >> treatment program. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >stupidity, and both of them agree it was downright stupid) how effective >would a treatment program be? I haven't a clue. I suppose it depends on whether or not he has a problem that interferes with his caring for the children or whether she's just giving him a hard time. We don't make all parents take drug tests. If he's never been arrested for drug related charges, then it's her word against his. He would be stupid to admit to a drug problem in a custody hearing. If he does, then he isn't denying that he has a problem and a treatment program will be effective. Even if he doesn't want to quit, there are ways to limit potential harm. Anyway, I wish her luck. It's a good goal.... drug free parents. 'Kate > I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with this... > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > this, assuming it was possible, and assuming it's a known fact that the > person is a drug user...? Realistically, she probably can't demand regular drug testing unless he's been convicted of drug use already - and she can't control what he does on his own time when the children are around, any more than he can control what SHE does on her own time when the children are not around. >> I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with this... >> [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > his own time when the children are around, any more than he can control > what SHE does on her own time when the children are not around. He was found to be high (on pot) and borderline drunk when he caused an accident a couple years back. The charges of DUI was dropped, but only because there were many other things found against him (accident being his fault, no insurance on his truck, outstanding warrants, etc.) and he did serve time in the slammer, although if I remember, it was only a couple days before it was just considered time served. She was saying that with a monthly drug test, anything can be detected within that month, if there's something to be found. IF something came down to this, and yes, this was just more casual convo I had with her, would a case like this come down to the person who has more money and support wins and the one with less money and support gets screwed? I don't know what I'm saying... ;) I'm saying let's say it's you and I in court. You have a lot more money and family support than I do, and you also have a good, clean bill of health and record. I'm the opposite with less money, less family to support me and I'm known to use drugs. Will you screw me over just because you have the means to do so, moreso than I do? >>> I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with this... >>> [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > He was found to be high (on pot) and borderline drunk when he caused an > accident a couple years back. The charges of DUI was dropped, Then he wasn't considered legally drunk, borderline or otherwise - because there's no way a DUI charge is dropped for lesser charges of not carrying insurance. but only > because there were many other things found against him (accident being his > fault, no insurance on his truck, outstanding warrants, etc.) and he did [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > would a case like this come down to the person who has more money and > support wins and the one with less money and support gets screwed? Here's what it would come down to...... how the judge might well see it - she's trying to dictate how he may and may not behave - not only when he has the kids, but when he doesn't. Judges frown on that sort of thing. > I don't know what I'm saying... ;) I'm saying let's say it's you and I in > court. You have a lot more money and family support than I do, and you > also have a good, clean bill of health and record. I'm the opposite with > less money, less family to support me and I'm known to use drugs. Will > you screw me over just because you have the means to do so, moreso than I > do? Me? No. This is, however, sounding more and more like she is trying to exert control over his personal life, something she has no legal right to do. 8>< a bit... > She simply said (to him) that there would be no need for courts and all > that. She would totally and fully agree 100% to him coming by and/or > spending time with the kids in or out of the house. She also said that if > it ever came to this, she would also request that the one and only > condition would be that he pisses clean once a month in order to see his > kids. That would, I guess, mean no drugs in his system at all. Wow!... does your uh...Friend have a controlling streak... > Anyone ever hear of this? Basically saying that in order to see your > child(ren) you have to stay off the drugs. That's all. One and only > 'condition'. What the guy does on his 'Off Time' ie. when he's not with the kids really is none of her business. Yep... tis right it would be better for all concerned if he was clean 24/7... but in this situation he only has to be 'straight' while he has responsibility for the kids... Would a court really get involved in something like this?... I would hope not... What happens if Mom says he can see the kids whenever so long as he doesnt drink?( cos that would be a bad example for the kids... right?)... or so long as he doesnt ever go to mass (cos the kids are anglicans, ok?), or so long as he doesnt see other women (cos the kids may get confused...ya know?).... etc etc etc...can-o-worms... z >8>< a bit... > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > >z Yep... that would be a can-o-worms. No one lives a pristine, idyllic lifestyle. What if someone insisted that we not date because it's not appropriate. Or what if someone decided that single parenting should be illegal and if a mother was a single parent, she must be on birth control or sterilized until she married? "Community standards" have a way of making unrealistic demands on people who are living non-traditional lifestyles. > Yep... that would be a can-o-worms. No one lives a pristine, idyllic > lifestyle. Except me....kinda ;-) > What if someone insisted that we not date because it's not > appropriate. Is *that* why you been turning me down all these years?... and here was I thinking you was just carrying a torch for Dennis... > Or what if someone decided that single parenting should be > illegal You mean it aint?... well it sure as heck should be... no wait...um > and if a mother was a single parent, she must be on birth > control or sterilized until she married? Hey!... you might be onto sumthin here... (saves awkward questions...) > "Community standards" have a > way of making unrealistic demands on people who are living > non-traditional lifestyles. Oh yeah... no wisecrack for that one... BTDTGTTS z ... save me a slice of wedding cake woncha? ... >> Yep... that would be a can-o-worms. No one lives a pristine, idyllic >> lifestyle. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Is *that* why you been turning me down all these years?... and here was I >thinking you was just carrying a torch for Dennis... It's the accent. Caliente! >> Or what if someone decided that single parenting should be >> illegal [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > >... save me a slice of wedding cake woncha? ... I will... my bestest friend might be able to come to the wedding... so looking forward to that. And as much as I try to eat nothing but salad and meat, I fail miserably. So I'm going to have to let go of the fantasy of looking amazing and settle for "she looks ok for her age". heh. I've been a little down lately. 'K > I've been a little down lately. You need a holiday. Ireland. ASAP Pick you up from then airport. Dennis >> I've been a little down lately. > >You need a holiday. Ireland. ASAP I sure do need a holiday... not this year though. That does make me a little sad. I was just looking through my oldest's trip to Europe. I cannot believe how beautiful it is there... Belfast Castle pics were astounding as were the Giant's Causeway pics. >Pick you up from then airport. > >Dennis <smile> Thank you for the invitation... and someday I'll take you up on it. It'd be good to see you and Freddie. I'd love a visit with Delores too. > condition > would be that he pisses clean once a month in order to see his kids. And she has to be breathalized before he gives them back. Any sign of alcohol in her system in the previous 30 days and he holds on to them. Dennis |
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